ADD Forums - Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder Support and Information Resources Community  

Go Back   ADD Forums - Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder Support and Information Resources Community > ADULTS AND ADD/ADHD > Adults with ADD > General ADD Talk
Register Blogs FAQ Chat Members List Calendar Donate Gallery Arcade Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-09-05, 05:01 PM
chain's Avatar
chain chain is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: People's Republic of Portland, Oregon
Posts: 643
Thanks: 0
Thanked 44 Times in 17 Posts
chain has disabled reputation
ADD and fragile Ego

Hi all,

Here is what I have been working on lately. It could be helpful to some of you so I will post it . First the caveat: I am not a medical health professional. This post is based on observations, research and experience that have been built into a model of cognition. If you see yourself in here, it is not coincidence. There are strong commonalities in people who are ADD.

What is Ego?:
Ego is an abstraction of self. It is a tool to help people join in and participate in groups. It is primarily concerned with correct marking behavior that say "I am a member of this group" and the ability to delay gratification for the good of the group "I will do my duty and be loyal to my group".

It provides abstract "invisible carrots and sticks" that keep people in line and provides the impulse to become a functional member of the group.


Ego has two states:
1. Dystonic: The ego is anxious, painful and causes “self doubting”
2. Syntonic: The ego is calm, pleasurable and creates “self assuredness”

Common Ego Structure: (ER)

Most people only go through an Ego dystonic state when joining a new group. If the ego dystonic state remains through “non-acceptance” by the group. The individual leaves the group. The pain caused by the ego dystonic state drives people to stay within their own “groups” based on “self image”, status and external marking (Race, age, gender, physical attractiveness…etc). Ego allows for a “stick” to keep an individual in line. It forces them to cooperate and delay gratification for the needs and survival of the group

ADD/AS Ego Structure: (IR (CM+ and IR+))

ADD is primarily ego dystonic. This is one of the reasons we have trouble joining groups. We rarely experience the “pleasure” of Ego. In the being alone or with people from groups outside our status and external marking, ego is not a factor. This drives us away from “like groups” and causes “self image” to be weak. This is functional in evolutionary terms. We need to spread genetic material outside of our tribe by leaving our "tribe" and mating with a person from another "tribe".

This causes what I term “Internal Reference”. It is also a driver in Autism Spectrum/Asperger’s.

Manipulators of the Ego Dystonic Individual.

Narcissistic Ego Structure: (ER+))
The opposite of ADD functionally (Although it may be diagnosed as ADHD) is “Narcissism”. The “Narcissist” is primarily Ego syntonic with brief but intense dystonic episodes known as “rages”.

“Psychopathic” Ego structure: (HM+)

Ego is eclipsed by “structure” and rules. It tends to drive paranoia. This type has the full spectrum of “ego dystonic – ego syntonic”.


Ego in the Brain:
Ego is stored in abstraction and fueled by dopamine. Dopamine drives pleasure for abstraction. (dopamine is the primary neurotransmitter affected by the ADD genetic marker (DRD4 )).

What are the signs of Ego in ADD?:
In most people there is a “tape recorder” that records and plays in the dystonic state. It plays back all social mistakes made. As soon as there is acceptance in the group, it shuts off. The group joining patterns are learned very early in childhood and cemented in a powerful ego dystonic phase during puberty. There is a subsequent dystonic phase in middle age (in both men and women) seen as “mid-life” crisis.

In ADD, since we are primarily in a dystonic state, ego has a very clear presence. We are in a near constant state of "childhood", “puberty” or “mid-life crisis”. The “tape recorder” rarely shuts off. It is most quiet in periods of intense “hyperfocus”. The effect of prolonged anxiety is depression: A state in which the body and mind are put in a "low energy" state to protect vital organs from sustained rushes of adrenaline.

With ADD there is no possibility of reaching a consistent ego syntonic state. The “tape recorder” must be turned off. Ego is there and always will be, but it is not and never will be functional for us.

Why do we "cling" to Ego if it is Dysfunctional?:

People who are ADD and AS are raised with a constant pressure to build ego and join groups. The emphasis on ego in culture is clear. We are bombarded by it. It is the way most people function. We are also the product of our dysfunctional childhoods and relationships. Ego is a leash. It is used to control people in groups and relationships. People with ADD and AS are much more sensitive to this. We are easily “suckered” by ego manipulators. On the playing field of ego, we are not skilled nor do we have a “group” to protect us.

The ego dystonic attract a type that is primarily ego syntonic. The narcissist is the smooth “self assured” person that we are attracted to. They are attracted to us in turn. They are “ego connoisseurs”. They can actually create a temporary ego syntonic state in ADD and AS. We in-turn are little threat to them on the playing field of ego. The “push/pull” of ego syntonic and ego dystonic states in the ADD individual creates massive confusion, anxiety and addiction to the Narcissist. They are threatened by our displays of self, they cannot compete on that field..so they keep us in an "ego clinging" state. If we leave the "ego clinging" state...they will run away after repeated "ego dystonic" rages. (they tend to come back though, especially during times of weakness for the ADD individual)

The Narcissist + ADD/AS “matrix" is something we are often born into. If you look around your family, it is usually not a “white picket fence” family. We are so accustomed to this type from our childhood (often one parent is a narcissist) that we are groomed to be with narcissists. This pattern is not functional or healthy for the ADD/AS individual.

What is the result of “Ego Clinging” in ADD/AS?
The result is continued relationships with abusers. This leads to a condition often seen as “low functioning Borderline Personality Disorder”(often diagnosed in women) or “Rapid cycling bipolar depression” (often diagnosed in men). Psychology is a product of the culture it lives in and is gender biased. These two things are “functionally” the same in the case of AS/ADD. The individual is thrown into a “survival state” by the stress. This occurs on the physiological level in ADD. We are in a state of “fight or flight”.

Common Signs of Severe "Ego Clinging" are:
Narcissistic/Histrionic behaviors (attempts to create an ego syntonic state)
Sensory Processing Disorder
(Heightened sensory input, listening for danger in a "fight or flight" state)
Clinging to loved ones or the abuser (Protection from perceived outside threats)
Pushing loved ones away (flight behavior)
Dangerous or compulsive sexual behavior (Safety in numbers, trade sex for safety)
Pseudologia Fantastica (living in an alternate “safe reality” in order to create an ego syntonic state)
Exhaustion and Depression followed by Energy and Enthusiasm: the enthusiasm is usually destructive or manic
Seeking abusive partners: (Searching for that “ego rush”)
Tourettes type tics:…A painful ego is very much like physical pain, it causes tics and repeated phrases to drown out the pain)
Extreme lack of focus: (Focus drives dopamine in healthy ADD, Ego driven dopamine reduces focus)
OCD Behaviors: Primarily in people that have been influenced by a strict parent that was rule driven.


What does ending “Ego Clinging” look like to the ADD/AS individual?:


Turning off the tape recorder is “simply” a matter of ignoring it. This can be “learned” through initial use of SSRI antidepressants (avoid SSNRI’s) with therapy that helps in building self. Meditation is useful (even with the racing mind of ADD). Avoid people who engage in ego manipulation. (This may mean divorce, breaking off relationships and limiting communication with parents). Building boundaries is vital. We can run but not hide from “ego manipulators” (Narcissists and “psychopaths” *). The will always be in our lives. With good boundaries, you can avoid being manipulated and even “turn” that manipulation around in the case that the individual is dangerous to you or your children.

After the “ego clinging” stops, creativity flows. Confidence comes back. When you don’t “care” what people think, you can redirect that energy into caring about what people feel…(with boundaries in place)

The "non-ego clinging state" looks like the “ego syntonic state” of the narcissist to the outside world. People will think you are arrogant. That is due to the inability to use ego in the way it was meant to be used. It is ok to be thought of as “arrogant” or even “narcissistic”. Humility itself is “egotistical”. There is always the ability to accept new ideas and people because your ego is not tied into “what you do or produce”. This is not present in narcissism. In the end, you can be a better parent, friend or member of your community.

It is a lifelong process but it is “the cure” for ADD.




* "Psychopath" (HM+)
The “psychopath” is often not “psychopathic” but extremely driven by rules, structure and iconic imagery. If they have the common ego structure (ER)they can be “pillars” of the community. but in a constant ego syntonic state (ER+) they manipulate to get possessions with dangerous rages that are life threatening to ”loved ones”. In an ego dystonic state (IR+HM+), they are driven by abstraction alone and tend to view people as "playthings". They have a very low level of feeling or sensation.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to chain For This Useful Post:
Afrikana (07-07-10), sambo88 (06-11-10)
  #2  
Old 10-09-05, 05:35 PM
mctavish23 mctavish23 is offline
 

Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 5,390
Thanks: 10,860
Thanked 8,253 Times in 2,562 Posts
mctavish23 has disabled reputation
Nice to see you back.

Hope all is well.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-10-05, 02:20 PM
luvmi3kids's Avatar
luvmi3kids luvmi3kids is offline
Member
 

Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Eastern NC
Posts: 75
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
luvmi3kids is on a distinguished road
Chain:

Wow.

That was very thought provoking. I can relate to that very well. When I was a child I was ostricized from classmates because of my "motormouth". By the time I was a teenager, I was "friends" with the other social misfits, but I always had this horrible longing to be accepted by those "popular" kids who made fun of me, who ostracized me, etc. I tried out for sports but didn't make it because of my poor coordination. I tried out for Flag Corps but didn't make it because, again, poor coordination. I kept trying and failing and being a laughing stock when the "popular" girls would report, "You should have seen Kristal try to spin that flag and hit herself in the head, hahahaha." And then I'd call them names, and then I'd end up in a fight. LOL

So, here I am today, no close friends because I don't want to go through all that again. I'm married and I have three kids. I have went through my entire life with that "tape recorder" telling me that I'm a failure. My oldest son has AS, and I can see him going through many of the same experiences I had. I push him to make friends and such, partially because of my own experiences. The poor kid is 14 and still only wants to talk about Yu-Gi-Oh cards and being a Jedi and his other "obsessions." And his problems again feel like my failures.

My hubby sat me down a week ago and told me that I am fine just the way I am, that I am not a failure, that I don't have to keep trying to "fix" myself and making myself miserable. So, the question is, how do you stop the tape recorder?
__________________
I Could Have Done So Many Things, Baby, If I Could Only Stop My Mind. . . The Eagles, "Wasted Time"

My crazy life as I know it
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #4  
Old 10-10-05, 02:53 PM
timh's Avatar
timh timh is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Northeast, Ohio
Posts: 618
Thanks: 0
Thanked 24 Times in 17 Posts
timh has a spectacular aura abouttimh has a spectacular aura about
Nice to see you back, too.

When do you find time to sleep?

I enjoy reading "your" theories. I will need to re-read this a couple times to let it sink in.

Very interesting observations.

Let the discussion begin.
__________________
Tim

- "Tim's incessant talking is wearing on all of us." (comment on 4th grade report card)

Cocktail : Adderall XR (10mg AM), Lexapro (10mg), Strattera (40mg AM/40mg PM)
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to timh For This Useful Post:
mjustice98 (02-12-11)
  #5  
Old 10-10-05, 04:08 PM
chain's Avatar
chain chain is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: People's Republic of Portland, Oregon
Posts: 643
Thanks: 0
Thanked 44 Times in 17 Posts
chain has disabled reputation
Quote:
Originally Posted by luvmi3kids
My hubby sat me down a week ago and told me that I am fine just the way I am, that I am not a failure, that I don't have to keep trying to "fix" myself and making myself miserable. So, the question is, how do you stop the tape recorder?
Dedicate yourself to ignoring it. Everytime it says something to you...dont listen. It never stops so turning it of is a matter of cranking the volume way down low. I honestly beleive that ADD is not the problem...the ego-dystonic nature is.

The true irony is: Since we have this tape recorder on all of the time as opposed to most people... we are very "self" correcting. A fully syntonic person does not care at all about who they hurt...nothing will damage that "ego image". Semi syntonic people care more but generally in the confines of their group or status. Extremely dystonic people care too much about everything.

So we can be fully ego dystonic and happy...by turning down the volume. How that is done is a quest for every person...but never underestimate the inventive nature of ADD

My Quest:
I used to try to drown out the negative feedback by saying a phrase over and over again. This never worked. The best solution was living in a foreign culture but since I have children, that is not a possibility.

Learning is a self based activity that shuts it off...so does creativity...but what do you do when you cannot do either?

I took Prozac to help with what seemed like "cycling depression" during the last year of my marriage. The recorder started to shut off more often. After I knew that it COULD be shut off...I then stopped the prozac and started to shut it off on my own.

The volume is so low now that my creativity is peaking. If someone does not like me, what I do, say or write...that is fine with me. The reason that I am coming up with these models and observations is that I now have the focus to "stitch" together contexts that were not connecting.

Some people (who are never dx'd ADD) have just the right upbringing to help them avoid the ego clinging tendancy...these people are not group joiners, still (ego is vital for group joining) but they are very well recieved and successful.

You have that capacity. So does your AS son.

Your Son:
The model shows that his interest in Star wars and Yu Gi Oh is simply the same pattern that all humans follow to "learn culture". He is "joining" a culture based on fantasy because he is not learning (and will not learn) how to be part of the one around him. This is a very strong AS traight and he will find other AS people who are doing the same...around the same themes. He needs AS friends. I personally see this as healthy. He just needs to temper it with other life skills. I would join in his interest and help him with those skills by extending lessons learned in star wars and use them to create outside interests. What new Star Wars stories can he come up with...may lead to an interest in writing.

The most important thing...is to teach him to be "functional" without fitting in.
If he is forced to fit in...the tape recorder gets louder and he will sink further into a fantasy world. He is different and lucky to be so... AS and ADD people are rockstars of creativity and invention.

Think about it as a computer processor:
Most people have the latest bloated OS from microsoft running on their brains (culture)...with plenty of virii and spyware. He is building his own lean and powerful OS.

Time not spent in the culture is processing time that can be devoted to learning and creating.


I am ADD and most likely AS (I don't translate other people's facial expressions into feelings). I would imagine that you are both too. I think it is a killer mix ;-)
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-10-05, 04:12 PM
chain's Avatar
chain chain is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: People's Republic of Portland, Oregon
Posts: 643
Thanks: 0
Thanked 44 Times in 17 Posts
chain has disabled reputation
Quote:
Originally Posted by timh
Nice to see you back, too.

When do you find time to sleep?

I enjoy reading "your" theories. I will need to re-read this a couple times to let it sink in.

Very interesting observations.

Let the discussion begin.
Sleep... What is that?

If I had my way... cat naps around the clock but the old work schedule does not allow for it...maybe if this book sells well I can go into 24 hour geek mode
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-10-05, 05:09 PM
timh's Avatar
timh timh is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Northeast, Ohio
Posts: 618
Thanks: 0
Thanked 24 Times in 17 Posts
timh has a spectacular aura abouttimh has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
Fear of ego damage causes anxiety. Ego damage causes rage.

Retrieved from "http://www.contextualmind.org/wiki/index.php?title=Ego"
I can see this relating to paranoia too. Also, fear of being rejected or removed from established groups and relationships. The person with ADHD has worked extremely hard and invested years to put processes into place to find a group or relationship where they "fit in".

If an established group membership or relationship is jepordized in anyway, the fear of ego damage starts, negative self-talk starts, paranoia sets in, anxiety is added and childhood memories of being excluded from groups might get dredged up all which could bring the onset of ADHD symptoms.

As Robert (mctavish23) has always said, "when it starts to affect one's life in a negative way, then it becomes a disorder. No negative affect, no disorder."

My life could fit into this model based on the events over the past two years, which led to my diagnosis of ADHD.
__________________
Tim

- "Tim's incessant talking is wearing on all of us." (comment on 4th grade report card)

Cocktail : Adderall XR (10mg AM), Lexapro (10mg), Strattera (40mg AM/40mg PM)
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-10-05, 05:57 PM
Imnapl's Avatar
Imnapl Imnapl is offline
ADDvanced Forum ADDvocate
 

Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 8,848
Blog Entries: 2
Thanks: 13,409
Thanked 3,782 Times in 1,931 Posts
Imnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond reputeImnapl has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by luvmi3kids
how do you stop the tape recorder?
Luv, please give your husband a hug from me and tell him I think he's a pretty nice guy.

We have another thread going about self-talk, if you're interested. http://www.addforums.com/forums/show...0&page=1&pp=15

It isn't enough to remove the negative voices on the tape recorder. We have to replace the negative with positive self-talk.
__________________
Things are not always what they seem; the first appearance deceives many; the intelligence of a few perceives what has been carefully hidden.

Phaedrus


Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-10-05, 06:06 PM
chain's Avatar
chain chain is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: People's Republic of Portland, Oregon
Posts: 643
Thanks: 0
Thanked 44 Times in 17 Posts
chain has disabled reputation
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imnapl
Luv, please give your husband a hug from me and tell him I think he's a pretty nice guy.

We have another thread going about self-talk, if you're interested. http://www.addforums.com/forums/show...0&page=1&pp=15

It isn't enough to remove the negative voices on the tape recorder. We have to replace the negative with positive self-talk.
Actually...most ADDers have lots of positive talk going on in self. Once you turn down that tape recorder...they bloom.

Positive and negative self image are bothe ego driven. The Dystonic ego that is that way from a very early age cannot be cajoled. Our egos are meant to be broken...every ADDer I have ever met (even the most positive ones) has vast amounts of negative ego input.

This is because...we simply do not understand "how to act like other people want us to, in order to join the group".

Turn the recorder off...and the positive voice are there...you cannot over shout over a non-functional ego...I have tried...it only works for people who have functional egos that have been raised in abuse and neglect.

Our egos simply don't work.

This is a ADD specific approach. Of course positive affirmations are nice...but they never turn off that tape.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-10-05, 06:11 PM
BlueRanger BlueRanger is offline
Suspended Account
 

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver Lowermainland Richmond
Posts: 76
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
BlueRanger is on a distinguished road
Is not ego.

is more like a self defense thing man , for me personal I get high anxiety when I do something that may make me look bad or dumb or stupid , because is defensive I guess if people already know I got ADD , I don't want them to think if I am more stupid then before , by doing something wrong.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-10-05, 06:12 PM
HighFunctioning's Avatar
HighFunctioning HighFunctioning is offline
Extradimensional Moderator
 

Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Not In Your Dimension
Posts: 3,866
Thanks: 339
Thanked 825 Times in 449 Posts
HighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant futureHighFunctioning has a brilliant future
This is all very interesting, Cory. Your tape-recorder idea especially reminds me of the description of Dr. Amen's Type
3 (overfocused). I have the tape-recorder syndrome myself.

Group membership exists on many different scales, from small circles of friends to large sets of people defined by some
common attribute. To the group member, the effort required to fit in is a reasonable sacrifice to gain security. Each
member of a group is a weak entity. Because the group member subconsciously knows that he or she is weak outside the
established group entity, the member is in competition with the other members. Rituals such as pressuring others or
humiliating others with non-conforming beliefs take place in order to further strengthen the set of core beliefs held by
the group members. These people live for their ego. Self is what puts them at risk of being kicked out of the group,
this being in an unfavorable position (as they are weak individuals).

With some people, the risk of being tied to the "ego leash" is not acceptable. One may have firmly held beliefs that
are in direct conflict with the ideas of the group (or they simply may not want to have total confidence in the group's
beliefs). In combination, one may not even be very good at "fitting in" anyway. So one is rejected and continues to
live in his or her own introspective world, developing his or her predisposed modality. We become stronger as
individuals than the ego-bound pack-wolves.

It's not always about how much you fit in. It's about not being in last place. Group membership is a competition. Ego
is a competition. We are the first to lose.

It's quite amazing how, even as adults, people still tend to be pack-wolves. I've met an ADDer that is "severely ego
clinging". By the examples of ego-clinging behaviors, I am sure many, if not most of us fit this bill. I have already
been consciously trying to build some of the boundaries you give examples of (parents, certain other people). I know
how manipulative parents can be. The relationship needs to happen in strict moderation for one's own health.

By the way, welcome back.
__________________
Disclaimer: none of the posts on this forum should be taken as medical advice. Optimally, always seek the opinion of multiple experienced professionals, note any discrepancies, and use your best judgment, as well as research, to determine what is true, untrue, and neither (opinion).
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-10-05, 06:15 PM
Hyperion Hyperion is offline
Forum Guru
 

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: The Biggest Little City in the World
Posts: 994
Thanks: 0
Thanked 29 Times in 15 Posts
Hyperion has a spectacular aura aboutHyperion has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
I honestly beleive that ADD is not the problem...the ego-dystonic nature is.
I think that at some point this becomes a bit of a "chicken and egg" question. It's like asking whether a particular cause of death is streptococcal bacteria or a 108 degree fever produced in response. If the neurological disorder which creates ADD also puts a person in a situation where they are chronically in an ego-dystonic state, then it's pointless to argue which is the "real problem."

Also, I'm not sure that SSRIs are the answer for an ADD-related depression. While the ADD could put someone in such a state, and being in that state could lead to depression, which can manifest itself as low serotonin levels, SSRIs aren't really treating the problem. Treating the ADD would be the most important issue, although obviously if the ADD has led to serious, clinical, long-term depression, then an SSRI might be necessary to treat this if it carries over even after the ADD itself is treated. I could see this being especially important if ADD in childhood led to enough traumatic situations as to cause serious psychiatric issues in adulthood.
__________________
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt.
- Bertrand Russell
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-10-05, 06:17 PM
chain's Avatar
chain chain is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: People's Republic of Portland, Oregon
Posts: 643
Thanks: 0
Thanked 44 Times in 17 Posts
chain has disabled reputation
Quote:
Originally Posted by timh
I can see this relating to paranoia too. Also, fear of being rejected or removed from established groups and relationships. The person with ADHD has worked extremely hard and invested years to put processes into place to find a group or relationship where they "fit in".

If an established group membership or relationship is jepordized in anyway, the fear of ego damage starts, negative self-talk starts, paranoia sets in, anxiety is added and childhood memories of being excluded from groups might get dredged up all which could bring the onset of ADHD symptoms.

As Robert (mctavish23) has always said, "when it starts to affect one's life in a negative way, then it becomes a disorder. No negative affect, no disorder."

My life could fit into this model based on the events over the past two years, which led to my diagnosis of ADHD.
Yes... loss of focus is driven by ego clinging...positive or negative.

In the models:
Paranoia = Reality Building of possible threat through Ego.

In a group situation...it becomes "mass hysteria" because ego has one main function: joining groups.

It is an extension of marking behavior and mating ritual... so you can see where else it might be important, ;-)

Paranioa is driven by things we cannot experience (abstractions)...Ego is an abstraction of self.

Self is where ADDers and AS build reality happily. These models that I am working on is a simple extension of that. Notice how immune you are to "mass hysteria".
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-10-05, 06:28 PM
chain's Avatar
chain chain is offline
ADDvanced Contributor
 

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: People's Republic of Portland, Oregon
Posts: 643
Thanks: 0
Thanked 44 Times in 17 Posts
chain has disabled reputation
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyperion
I think that at some point this becomes a bit of a "chicken and egg" question. It's like asking whether a particular cause of death is streptococcal bacteria or a 108 degree fever produced in response. If the neurological disorder which creates ADD also puts a person in a situation where they are chronically in an ego-dystonic state, then it's pointless to argue which is the "real problem."
Yes...but the solution becomes clear...you can not "cure" ADD but you can become more functional through learning how to deal with an ego-dystonic state instead of chasing an ego-syntonic one. If the ego is non-functional in ADD...this would mean learning to ignore it instead of trying to make it positive.

What is being a "good person"?...what is being "smart"?, "handsome"?..etc...

These are reflections from ego..they are abstractions...I honestly do not know what they mean...so how am I supposed to use them in positive affirmations?

I have trouble understanding what I look like...when I look in a mirror. I recognize myself but cannot compare myself to others in any way. Am I fat? Am I good looking?

I cannot even "mark" myself. I am not a 35 year old man...I am a person with experiences and feelings. Age and Gender are 2 markings that are things that most people understand strongly through their ego.

I am not alone in this
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-10-05, 06:32 PM
BlueRanger BlueRanger is offline
Suspended Account
 

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver Lowermainland Richmond
Posts: 76
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
BlueRanger is on a distinguished road
Hey some people actully talk on this forum?

Hey I got ADHD

and I am new to this forum , yeah by the way the ego thing is just that we don't have a huge ego , in fact we have little so call ego , is just that because we have so little pride we worry our pride will break by only very small things do you understand?

I worry about every small things people may think about me when in reality they don't but I think anyways , and then you start becoming a little more crazy , you think about what other people is thinking.


you think is unhealthy right? yeah is very unhealthy I think I can go insane this way one day but at the end , it helps me on other thing , I can tell a lot of things what people thinks by their face a lot of times.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
NPD (Narcissist)/ ADD Binary relationship chain Relationships & Social Issues 23 02-19-14 01:03 PM
Odd Couples Nova Non-ADD Partner Support 56 02-19-06 05:12 PM
glass houses and ADD Gourmet General ADD Talk 12 06-19-05 12:34 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
(c) 2003 - 2014 ADD Forums