Dopamine: Too much or too little?

[2Busy2Think]

Alright my ADD is primarialy action orientation problems, as well as thinking too much. Thoughts fill my mind so quickly that I forget to slow down and consider each one, instead It feels like someone else is running my brain. Like the remote control is in the hands of someone else, and they are changing the channels. I can focus on the channel I am watching, but then it changed unexpectedly and I am on to the next thing.

When I take meds, my brain feels sooooo calm, and serene. to describe it, imagine being forced to read page after page of random unrelated sentences all day long. Then, imagine someone giving you a blank sheet of paper after years of the latter, and then taking out a pen and writing what YOU want to write.

Its pretty amazing. I am so grateful for medications like adderall dex and ritalin. But I am seeking a natural solution, and to help me pinpoint my problem, I need to know if my type of add ( described above ) is the result of too much dopamine, too little dopamine, or something else.

Side Note: I can focus, infact I usually focus for about 20 minutes on something. I will find some information about something I was thinking about, and that is enough to satisfy my need for knowledge.

Comments? Thoughts? Opinions?

[ben72227]

Reduced dopamine concentrations in the prefrontal cortex are thought to contribute to ADD.

So what happens with most of the drugs is that Amphetamine (i.e. Adderall) binds to the dopamine transporter (DAT) and blocks the transporters ability to clear DA from the synaptic space.

Basically - the dopamine normally just flows through the synaptic space. Since we (us ADDer's) don't have enough dopamine - the drugs block the dopamine transporters from moving the dopamine through - so dopamine just piles up in the synaptic space and our dopamine levels increase and thus - we can focus.

[QueensU_girl]

some people can concentrate better (slow down the fast thoughts & focus) by exercising daily. or a few times daily.

exercise improves brain function.

(john ratey aka Driven to Distraction is coming out with a new book about the mental benefits of exercise, soon....)

www.johnratey.com

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Dopamine Glitches:

There are about 10 or so ways that neurons or neurotransmitter can get messed up before/at/after the synaptic binding site. No one can say for sure. Same with Schizophrenia and dopamine dysfunction in the frontal lobe/prefrontal cortex. (reference textbook: 'physiology of behavior', by N. Carlson)

ADHD/ADDers are supposedly dopamine or dopamine receptor deficient (not enuf binding sites to use dopamine). anyway: either way you slice it, we don't have enough. stimulants boost dopamine levels.

[2Busy2Think]

Ben that was an awesome description of how Adderall works. I have read several documents on the web that discuss "blocking the reuptake" of dopamine. Your explanation gave me a real visual picture (Guess im a visual learner arent I) and now I understand how adderall works. Thank you for your clear concise input, much appreciated!

Clarify I Understand Correctly;

So dopamine (which is in our blood I presume) flows through parts of our brain, and our dopamine receptors attract like a magnent the dopamine, and they bind together. With the dopamine now bound to the receptor, the dopamine works.

So in an ADD persons brain, the receptors dont use the dopamine thats passing through, so a DA transporter comes along and wipes out the excess dopamine like a street sweeper does on the streets. So adderall blocks the street sweeper from leaving the street where dopamine lives, thus the dopamine is forced to enter a house (receptor)

:-) Did I get that correct?

Originally Posted by ben72227

Reduced dopamine concentrations in the prefrontal cortex are thought to contribute to ADD.

So what happens with most of the drugs is that Amphetamine (i.e. Adderall) binds to the dopamine transporter (DAT) and blocks the transporters ability to clear DA from the synaptic space.

Basically - the dopamine normally just flows through the synaptic space. Since we (us ADDer's) don't have enough dopamine - the drugs block the dopamine transporters from moving the dopamine through - so dopamine just piles up in the synaptic space and our dopamine levels increase and thus - we can focus.

[2Busy2Think]

Oh by the way, something odd is when I take adderall I sometimes fall asleep for a short period of time, say 1 hour. When I wake up, I feel so well rested, calm and relaxed that I wonder if dopamine has something to do with normal sleep cycles.

A typical night for me includes hours of grinding my teeth so loudly it wakes others in my house, and makes the dog lick my face until I wake up. When I take adderall, I sleep with my mouth open!

Reading that exclaimation point, you might say to yourself, so what. Who cares? Well I have never slept with my mouth open, I always clench my jaw so tightly that have headaches when I wake. So sleeping on adderall, although difficult for long periods of time, is sometime I have come to appreciate very much.

[2Busy2Think]

Side Tangent - Isnt it amazing how much you can remember if you only can focus on something!? I mean, if I hear something only one time when I am on meds, it sticks like glue and I can remember it a day, a week, sometimes longer.

If I hear something without meds, I know I hear it, but I completely forget it within nanoseconds. Like peoples names for example! Hi im John. (chatter) Alright, talk to you later MAN. Seems I call everyone MAN these days, I cant remember their names!

COFFEE!? So if this is how adderall works, does coffee work in the same way? Does that mean if I drink enough espressos I will be just as focused as I am on adderall?

[bramr1]

God how I would love to stop grinding my teeth at night!.. im not on meds.. yet.

[Dynamicism]

You guys do the teeth grinding thing too? I'm pretty sure I only started doing it within the past couple years... not sure why it started up, but it's mad annoying and I'm afraid of screwing up my teeth over it. As far as I know, it's only while I'm awake... if I make a concerted effort to focus on it, it stops. But will often start up autonomically whenever I'm honed in on other things. The stimulants definitely do help inhibit it though.

[bramr1]

thats completely strange... cause I dont want to wear a mouth gaurd to sleep but wow.. its amazing what an opposite effect amphets have on ADHD types.. i thought normally meth and amphetamines make folks grind bad.. I once was grinding my teeth while sleeping and it was so loud it woke up my friend sleeping on the couch in the other room, and when I tried to go back to sleep to keep my mouth from hurting I bit into a pillow case to fall asleep... the next day=complete splitting headache.

[2Busy2Think]

Woah, I have a theory. I just read in this post above that we dont have a shortage of dopamine rather a lack of binding sites. So maybe ADHD has evolved from a generation of men and women who chose not to focus most of their life.

How many of your parents are highly successful? How many of your parents are failures? How many of your parents drink daily? This all could mean something.

[FrazzleDazzle]

2Busy, some individuals have had a lot of luck working with the amino acids therapy. They work a lot like the medications when they work. I actually am persuing this for my son, he has an appointment with a NMD who will assess him and do a testing kit, to see which amino acids to work with. The amino acids work on the neurotransmitters, (dopamine, seratonin levels, etc.) depending on the particular chemistry of an individual.

[DesertDave]

How did this assessment work out? Was it expensive?


And how did I end up at this old thread? There is so much to read here.

[Mincan]

Originally Posted by 2Busy2Think

Woah, I have a theory. I just read in this post above that we dont have a shortage of dopamine rather a lack of binding sites. So maybe ADHD has evolved from a generation of men and women who chose not to focus most of their life.

How many of your parents are highly successful? How many of your parents are failures? How many of your parents drink daily? This all could mean something.

No, too many transporters... why blocking transporter is what it does. Perhaps more receptors too. Perhaps severed connections between frontal lobes and midbrain.

[lovelyophelia]

Wait. Parkinsons disease is caused by problems in creating dopamine. I think it's important to clarify that where the dopamine deficiency is creates different problems. In the frontal lobes, it can cause ADHD. In the basal ganglia, it causes Parkinsons disease.

But... why are there only deficiencies of dopamine in certain parts of the brain and not the whole brain?