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Old 02-12-08, 11:20 PM
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Talking ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

It's my first time posting here but I have been here as a guest quite a few times.I need some help and have seen there are smart individuals here who might be able to help me. Please forgive me for the rant. Please give me facts and not lectures or make me feel bad for things I cant take back. Please help me, or give me some advice as to where I might get help.

I'm 20 years old and I was using meth for a year. Now a meth user will tell you this wont affect you much. It's TRUE too, meth wont affect you as much as people will have you believe (Just read the facts)
The addiction will though.. And MAN was I had addiction multiplied by bad things happening around me and severe deppression. So it was like...
Not just normal amounts. It was not just "Lots" it was using Ridiculous amounts. Like hundreds of dollars a week amounts where as even tweekers and hard core people would not do that. Like amounts where even drug addicts look at you and go "Your not even trying to get high, your just killing yourself." The kind of amounts where I actually still FEEL like I poisoned my body. THOSE kinds of amounts. And I know and willingly admit this, so if you STILL think I am going to think much about a "Meth is bad, m'kay" lecture then you are welcome to do so. I just ask you don't as it's not why I am here. I have no job anymore (laid off for totally innocent reasons mind you) so I obviously have not been doped out on meth nor do I want it ever again. The thing is this:

I"ve done alot of research on meth. I was doing it even when I was using. Being ADHD and using meth is crazy. You've obviously heard someone say "Ritalin is like speed." Well meth is speed times.. Times alot!

I have a deficiency of dopamine in my brain (ring any bells?). What I did NOT know till later was that Meth destroys that further. In fact many of the reports I have read said that even after eighteen months I'll only be able to get to 8/10ths (80%) as much dopamine as I once had.
The funny (or not so much) thing is, since I already supposedly have a dopamine deficiency, that brings me to some even lower percentage. I'm taking L-Tyrosine and some hi-potency b stress vitamens to help as I read they might. But this is just one of those reallll rare 'happy moments'

In reality though my 'happy moments' are still far short of what they once were. That's mostly due to meth and fighting the addiction yes thank you, but some of it is having ADHD too. To make matters WORSE I have no GED, No drivers liscence, no money, no job and family problems.

When I dropped out of highschool I pretty thought I died inside. But every day I find another reason why to be deppressed. It wont end. It wont stop, and the only thing keeping me from suicide right now is.. Well nothing. Infact I'm sinking into this dark pit of despair and groping around for a hand hold to get out but I keep failing. I feel like I have to walk up a mountain to be happy. But it's raining. The ground is muddy. And there's f***ing bears at the top ready to kick my a** and send me back to the bottom if I even try!

I need a lot of things but right now I need help the most. If I cant find a doctor I can see for free I know I'm capable of a real lot of bad stuff. The only time I was ever even SOMEWHAT level was when I was on medication, and I dont have the money for it anymore.

People to talk to who understand severe deppression would help (it's why I'm here.) Suicide hotlines and those sort of unpersonal things I've tried and found unhelpful. A place where I can find a free councelor or doctor would be nice too. These are the things I really need right now.

Help?
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Old 02-12-08, 11:28 PM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Welcome to the forums! I'm sorry things are in such a rough place right now. You might call the local university and see if they have free counseling available through the counselor intern programs there.

I hope you will also check out a 12 step program. I've had amazing changes in my life as a result of working that program. 12 step groups are also a good source of support and it sounds like you could use some now.

Take care and hang in there!
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Old 02-12-08, 11:47 PM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

TBT,

You have lot on your plate right now. Congratulations for taking the first and hardest step of realizing you need help. That takes a lot of strength and courage.

Many of us at ADDF have ADHD and Depression. We are glad to share our experiences, struggles, and successes. We don't have all the answers--it would be nice wouldn't it? Depression is very tough to live with and it is really important that you find help where you live. There are many resources where you live, but having depression can make it very hard to have the energy to find and access them. Personally, I feel that finding and asking for help in San Diego is your next step. It won't be easy, but you can do it just like you shared here. The other members and I will be glad to do what we can to support you through this tough time in your life.

So you can continue on the path to finding treatment and recovering, please read on. I will share some suggestions and ideas. The next paragraph will help you understand what ADDF offers to its members and what it cannot do.
Just so you know and aren't disappointed, the guidelines say our posts don't constitute medical advice. Even people who have medical jobs/training can't give medical advice.
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You live in San Diego, ADDF members are from all over the world and don't know what is available in SD. Get the phone book out or online yellow pages. There are many places where you can get help from non-profit organizations on a sliding scale or free. It may take a bit of time and effort, but check out what services are offered that meet your needs. They do exist and many drug companies are providing medications to patients who are financially unable to pay for depression medication.

Don't forget about Narcotics Anonymous. Those groups are free to attend, anonymous and they may be able to give you information about where to find medical treatment and counseling. You might find depression support groups at hospitals, churches, clinics, and other locations.

What we can and do give at ADDF is support and encouragement to each other. If you scroll down the main page you will see there are separate forums for co-existing disorders like depression and substance abuse. There is also a private forum for substance abuse too. Check those out.

My best to you as you work towards recovery and out of depression,
VI
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Old 02-12-08, 11:50 PM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Yup.

re: risk of motor problems
Meth can even destroy the main dopamine manufacturing site in the brain (called the 'substantia nigra'), which can lead to a movement disorder that looks like/mimics Parkinson's Disease. Dopamine greatly affects motor cortex function (movement).

http://www.bnl.gov/bnlweb/pubaf/pr/2001/bnlpr030101.htm

In fact, one of my 3rd year psychology lab [neuroscience] courses actually created animal models of this type of brain damage in RATS. (Yes, our brains are a lot like Rat's brains.)

re: risk of drug-induced psychotic disorders
Speed and cocaine and marijuana are also known to be psychotogenic, too. (Can induce psychosis, hallucinations and delusions aka impaired perceptual function and 'reality testing'.)
Seen that more than a few times.

In my generation (the mid 80's) -- when pot use was the most commonly used of those drugs -- before coke/crack and meth were big -- it seemed that *every high school* had a few of those pothead burnouts who 'went wacky' (to never come backy), I think.

Heartbreaking.

Run away from that stuff, dude.

NB ADDers taking legit meds are taking 1/100 or 1/200 the dose of speed abusers.

e.g. My Dexedrine is 5 mg. A meth abuser will swallow a gram (1000 mg). That is 200x as much drug...

As PARACELSUS most famously said: "The poison is in the dose...". So, essentially, 'a pinch of salt' will make your food taste good, but downing 'the whole BOX' will kill you. =:O

Last edited by QueensU_girl; 02-13-08 at 12:02 AM..
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Old 02-12-08, 11:53 PM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThinkBadThought View Post
People to talk to who understand severe deppression would help (it's why I'm here.) Suicide hotlines and those sort of unpersonal things I've tried and found unhelpful. A place where I can find a free councelor or doctor would be nice too. These are the things I really need right now.

Help?
I spent the last few years down there in SD before I came up here.. UCSD grad myself. I've had a lot of the same problems down there (sans the drug addiction but that's another story..). Here's a couple of helpful links:

http://sandiego.networkofcare.org/mh...tail.cfm?id=28 <-- info on county of SD mental health services - not sure what they can actually do but their statement says that they never deny anyone services regardless as to ability to pay.

http://www.namisandiego.org/providers.html <-- NAMI, the advocacy/support group. Fairly good people there in SD County, did some fundraisers/awareness campaigns with them.

http://www.mhasd.org/about_us.htm <-- Mental Health America, San Diego Branch. Has some phone # but their numbers are not just crisis but how to obtain help.

Do you have insurance? College student? Either one should have the ability to help. UCSD's insurance was getting -very- jacked up when I graduated.. think it's a lot worse now.

I haven't been back in nearly 2 years (when I moved). I actually don't really miss it. The warm weather was nice but I dunno.. it was rough down there for me. Nice place however.

619 baby, southside Palm/Beyer ave.. lively hood down that way Take care bro.
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Old 02-12-08, 11:55 PM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

I wish I had great words of wisdom to help you, and that I knew of some free place for you to get help. I don't have that.

I do understand depression. That black cloud has followed me my entire life. I struggle with alcoholism, and have found 12 step programs like AA somewhat helpful. I still struggle though. Also, you might consider SMART recovery- just goggle it. They have forums, tools, and a 24 hour chatroom with some really nice people. Even if you are no longer struggling with the meth thing, you might find the fellowship helpful.

That pit does suck. I have been in and out of it all my life. I don't know about what alcohol or meth has done as far as dopamine goes, but I do know this: Even though a lot of my life has sucked, (I'm 45) I'm still glad that I got to live it. I have two great kids and a marriage that has lasted nearly 25 years despite my being a mess.

Somewhere on this site, (or somewhere?) I think I did see something about financial help for meds. I'll try to see if I can find it.

I wish I could be more helpful. Hang in there

Trish

(hums..."these are a few of my favorite things"..loved that song when I was, like four.)
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Old 02-13-08, 01:00 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

hi there.. I have been where you are at.. I did meth like crazy for 3 years.. Got sober at 19 im 23 now.. The aftermath of meth is not cool.. but if you stay sober things will slowley start getting better. Try some meeting. There are so many young recovering tweakers in recovery its not even funny. message me if you want.
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Old 02-13-08, 04:24 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

If meth can cause your level of dopamine to drop after constant use. Why cant pharmacuticals?
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Old 02-13-08, 04:30 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThinkBadThought View Post
I have a deficiency of dopamine in my brain (ring any bells?). What I did NOT know till later was that Meth destroys that further. In fact many of the reports I have read said that even after eighteen months I'll only be able to get to 8/10ths (80%) as much dopamine as I once had.
That's not entirely true. Methamphetamine is basically just a stronger form of amphetamine (dexies, Dexedrine, Adderall). It increases the amount of dopamine available and is a scheduled drug authorised in the treatment of ADHD (it's called Desoxyn) in America (but not Australia). In therapeutic (prescribed) doses, Desoxyn causes no significant neural degeneration. This is because methylation of amphetamine changes its physical shape and makes it do more in the brain - it acts on all 4 amines (serotonin, norepinephrine, adrenaline, dopamine) instead of just the two involved in ADHD (dopamine, norepinephrine) and the neural damage is thought to be caused by the way it oxidises dopamine.

In the doses you were taking it was probably royally ****ing you up, ADHD or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThinkBadThought View Post
To make matters WORSE I have no GED, No drivers liscence, no money, no job and family problems.
You can still get these things, no? Every year we have a few 60 year olds finish the high-school certificate. There's no age limit on a driver's licence, and the government should be giving you a pension or the dole while you figure things out, right? Try and work towards something basic, like a 6 month, 1 semester certificate at a community college, then see where you can go after that.
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Old 02-13-08, 05:28 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Welcome to the forum!
I've struggled with depression and it was quite bad in my 20's. I didn't respond to medication and there was no other help available. I was without support of any kind, unemployed, isolated. It was a very dark period. The worst thing was, i couldn't imagine life ever being different.
There was no defining moment, no light bulb or any one thing that changed my life. I just kept going, kept living, tried a bit harder when i could. I got some work, got a cheap car, got my driving licience, kept going. I'm 36 now and life is better. I don't consider myself a very strong person, and my ADD makes me feel overwhelmed most of the time, so i figure if i can make my life better then pretty much anyone can!!!!!
For some reason i really feel that ADHD alone will not stop you in this life. When i read your post i was struck by your intelligence, and this sense that you are a person who could really make an impression in life. I don't know what its like fighting depression and addiction together, i've never been through that. And i live in Australia so i can't give you advice re doctors and counsellors. But keep fighting, keep going. You face a lot of problems, but you're only 20, you have a brain in that skull of yours -there is so much that could happen in your life!
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Old 02-13-08, 06:11 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraz_2006 View Post
If meth can cause your level of dopamine to drop after constant use. Why cant pharmaceuticals?
Dopamine depletion from meth and pharmaceuticals stimulants is not the problem anyway. Too much dopamine from the meds is more likely the problem. The receptors adjust to the excess dopamine by becoming less sensitive to it. That massive pool of excess dopamine that is created by taking ever increasing doses to get a rush is what gets oxidized by free radicals to produce the neurotoxic effects from mega-dose stimulant abuse. Though there is a study showing neurotoxicity effects from normal dose ADHD meds to.
So there maybe a risk spectrum for all use of stimulants.

Someone with a significant stimulant abuse history should avoid stimulants.
The prescribing guideline for the meds will say that. Your need for
dopamine elevating effects could be meet with wellbutrin without the abuse risk
or neurotoxicity.
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Old 02-13-08, 08:26 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

As a San Diego native ( both my husband and i ), we know what it's like to live where tweekers are EVERYWHERE. Practically on every street corner ( literally )...especially in East County. We also know how hard it can be to step out of it when it's everywhere you look.

When i was in my teens i was without ADD meds, and inadvertantly found Meth. For the time it seemed like it was a great substitute for the meds i really needed, and i can't tell you all the problems it caused; not just physically, but in my brain. Thankfully, i hit bottom at 18...which is early to do so...and literally quit cold turkey. Walked away and never touched it again. i have now been meth free for 18 years.

Having been there, you and i both know that when it comes to meth there is no " weaning " yourself off of it. You simply have to stop. Period. After 3 days it will be out of your bloodstream. You will still smell it for a few days as it leaves your body through your pores ( you know, THAT smell ), which will probably bring back your craving for it, but you CAN ignore it, and you CAN get clean.

i'm living proof that not everyone that gets sucked into it gets trapped there forever. Noone can make you do this except you, and you gotta want to be clean bad enough to do whatever you need to do to seperate yourself from not only the drug, but the people and the places where you know you will find it. You know...like when you have'nt done any but go to visit a friend and find when you get there that it's out on the table as a party favor. Yeah, that makes it harder. Guess what the right move is for YOU at that moment??? To leave the house and go elsewhere. So you have to be rude to someone else to do something good for YOU. Then DO IT. We both know those people aren't going to be the ones to help you out of this and help save your life. If they were, then they wouldn't be offering you more of it.

Having become a counselor as an adult, i know of some places in SD that you could try. Alpine Special Treatment Center, Aurora Behavioral Health...there are more.
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Old 02-17-08, 11:38 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Your post is very touching and I hope maybe you have found some kind of Lifeline or support.
I was introduced to meth by my ex- husband when I was 20. He was ADHD, I was not diagnosed at the time so I didn't take it for that.
I took only on weekends at first then everyday, then later to help me thru the day, as I never slept that long.
I stopped with both pregnancies,did alittle more after first son was born, then just stopped, cold turkey, after last child was born as I wanted out of that scene, even seperated from ex by moving away from everything associated with it.
I got paranoid on it thought i was going to die from a heart attack (I never undestood how people can take very high doses like that! I would freak out!).
I haven't touched it in 19 years, thank God! Never will again.
I am on Adderall 5 mg XR, right now. Upping it to 10mg. Just concerned how yuor Brain is producing seretonin and how much.
I am moody ( could be hormones affecting me also) and irritable alot of the times, my mood changes very quickly sometimes,getting better, I get upset over "little" things, occasionally.
Taking Amino acids, b vitamins, stress capsules, and mood enhancing vitamins and heris helping.
Guarana helps on days when I don't take meds.
I know you are soooo young and you can get your GED, you can get a License, go to school and take a course that fits your schedule or life, you always have Hope that it WILL get better, these Amino acids and Vitamins( L-tyrosine helps, 5-HTP is great for mood, Dopaime and sleep, etc). I never knew that the meth affected our Brains to such an extent but in time you can rebuild most of the negative effects of Dopaime norephrine levels if you take care of yourself, eat right, excercise, take Supplements. It all help's. Don't give up on yourself. THere are help groups and individuals all around you.
I congratulate you on the first step in admitting this and asking for help.
Keep moving forward and it will get better.
HUGS!
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Old 02-19-08, 06:25 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

First time poster, long time reader of the forums too... Hopefully some of what I have to say may help you or other readers out with this. It's kind of lengthy and I have a tendency to be (overly) wordy at times, but bear with me.

To start off with, and my original reason for posting this, is that if you live in or near a big city there should be somewhere available to help you. Here in Tucson we have a free place that will help you get treatment, start medication, and whatever else you need. It's really helped a few of my friends get back on their feet. The website is http://www.samhc.com/ if you want to check the place out, hopefully you can find something similar in your area...

Part of what made me realize I had ADD was dabbling in meth when I was younger. When I tried it (and I was doing .5-1g at a pop), instead of feeling any significant rush (mild euphoria is the only real recreational effect I felt) I just felt what I thought normal should feel like.

The negative effects outweighed the positives for me relatively quickly: The worst was the sleeplessness, which quickly took the feeling of normal away (staying up for a couple days at a pop is no good for your body). Plus, instead of increased sexuality, I felt a lack of sexuality - something I for one don't enjoy. Also, it interacted with my TID 50mg dose of Tramadol to control the pain from scoliosis, back injury, and arthritis in my spinal column - pretty ridiculous considering how young I was then... Still ridiculous at 24. The tramadol and meth combination gave me the worst headaches of my life, so my option on that was extreme debilitating back pain or supposed mental normalcy.

I think I'm lucky in that I've never had an inclination towards addiction - and I've tried (almost) everything. Whenever something made me feel bad, I just stopped before it could really get a hold of me and start causing its own problems. What I have had was just a curiosity towards drugs that despite its shortcomings, I think has taught me many things about life that I myself could only have learned by experience.

Adding to this my experience both having many addicted friends and working in mental health and substance abuse (though I hardly claim to know everything) has given me a good perspective from the inside and the outside. A few of the more important lessons I learned were:

1.) Most importantly, that to feel normal is possible (but going that route isn't worth the consequences)

2.) That perceiving things differently helps you solve problems and make important realizations (but it's better to do it with your own healthy coping mechanisms)

3.) That the negative side effects of drug abuse will set in, and I'd wager from my experience with many people that this is where addiction either sets in or doesn't. Once you have decided to routinely use something as a band-aid (further explained in #4) it becomes more an obsession to get back to the original state you were in before drugs.

4.) As a consequence, that those who do face the problem of addiction by and large are doing it or began doing it out of a desire to feel better about very real and negative situations going on in their lives. It's rare to see an addict without something else (abuse, mental disorders, financial trouble, the list goes on) going on in their lives.

I wish that drug addiction was viewed by the general public and the justice system as something to be viewed with empathy, kindness, and the desire to help rather than the inclination to hurt. From my eyes, seeing those who have gotten support from loved ones and treatment (and not just for drugs), and those who have only gotten legal and financial consequences, what our justice system should be doing is clear. We punish what we fear. When parents take the time to listen to their children, spend time with them, recognize unavoidable psychological problems at the earliest possible stage and seek help immediately, and in general do what is necessary to make their children well-adjusted, they should have little fear that their child will have a reason to become self-medicating and, in turn, addicted. The children (who become adolescents and adults in turn) who don't have this kind of support don't really feel they have much that they can turn to for help. To them, drugs seem a viable way to escape the inner turmoil - the pain that living can bring.

I hope this doesn't open a can of worms here - I'm not looking to argue, but more just to state my opinion about this topic. As far as drugs are concerned, they aren't an inherent evil. One can recreationally use anything and still continue to say no most of the time. I know I'm proof of that, and I can't be the only one. I generally had the support I needed from my family when things went badly for me. Honestly, in my opinion l think that drugs should be legal, but controlled and monitored. That way once use turns into abuse and in turn, addiction, the registered drug user could get appropriate intervention before things got worse. In addition, drugs would lose their mysterious and dangerous appeal. Drugs wouldn't have all the horrible adulterants and impurities that kill more people than anything. Perhaps most importantly, once they were an accepted part of society and no longer such a stigma, those who lost their way with drugs would feel they were able to get the help they needed rather than being saddled with a fear of punishment, guilt, and a feeling of nowhere else to turn. In this way, we could reduce so many personal harms that come from drugs, reduce the burden on our economy that incarceration and policing brings, and gain the many benefits of members of our society that we have left behind.

Anyhow, this has touched many areas of this topic. If you read it all, thanks for making it this far. My central theme and idea is that if you feel you need help, you should be able to get it. Nobody in this world is alone, no matter how easy it is to feel that way. Drugs can be a comfort blanket, and it can be hard to step out and make changes in your life... But once you can wake up and feel the light of the sun, the chill of the night, and the rain on your face with your own natural senses, it will be worth it. You can feel the way you were supposed to feel.

Good life, good experiences, good luck.
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Old 02-19-08, 09:02 AM
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Re: ADHD, Meth. Need FREE HELP!

Quote:
Originally Posted by botulismo View Post
I wish that drug addiction was viewed by the general public and the justice system as something to be viewed with empathy, kindness, and the desire to help rather than the inclination to hurt. From my eyes, seeing those who have gotten support from loved ones and treatment (and not just for drugs), and those who have only gotten legal and financial consequences, what our justice system should be doing is clear. We punish what we fear.
Yeah I like President Jimmy Carters quote on it:

Quote:
Penalties against possession of a drug should not be more damaging to an individual than the use of the drug itself. -- President Jimmy Carter, Aug. 2, 1977
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