Advice on Doctors, Meds, Amen Clinic....

[jondoeai]

Hello,
I am a first time poster that has benefited from reading this site. I have decided to write right now because I need personal advice.
I'm a 27-year-old male who has struggled with being Bipolar and ADHD for a number of years. I was diagnosed with Bipolarity nine years ago and ADHD two years ago. I have struggled with a lot of the issues associated with these disorders for over thirteen years. These struggles have ranged from not leaving the house except to go to my psychiatrist for two years, to not being able to attend or be effective in school for eleven years. Currently, I am at UC Berkeley trying to study Math. I decided two years ago that I wanted to study math and started at re-studying high school algebra and a year later I was studying abstract algebra, that is, upper division algebra. This required a lot of work and adderall. I emphasize adderall because before I was diagnosed with ADHD I hated math and was unable to be interested enough to concentrate. Since June '07, after I had made all this progress, I have stopped making progress in math or school. At first, I was burnt out and I had to take an incomplete in Summer School. I was taking 30mg of Adderall XR and 15mg of Adderall IR as needed. Then in fall '07, I had to take an incomplete in another math class. I was taking the same dose of Adderall. Then in spring of '08, I switched to 100mg of Stratterra and 100mg of Provigil with 15mg of Adderall IR as needed. This was because the Doctor thought I was taking too much Adderall. Being that this was a University Doctor, she was wary of me potentially abusing Adderall because Adderall abuse is common.
So with all this said I have made some progress in studying math on my own and no progress in math on record since June of 2007.

This week my psychiatrist told me that my medications for ADHD were too complicated for her because she wasn't an expert in ADHD. The doctor said I should get a comprehensive psychological test and see a psychiatrist who specializes in ADHD. The test would include ADHD, learning disabilities, and anything else they test for. The doctor thinks that I have a learning disability and that is why I haven't made progress in math. When I was younger, I was dyslexic; I don't know if this was a phase or is still a relevant concern. The doctor doesn't know how to treat my ADHD because her attempts at treatment start well and then have diminishing results. She said for other students she'll give them some stimulant and that'll be the end of it. But my problems aren't that simple.

I am looking for solutions for my problems. I realized last night that I have been going to some specialist for learning or a psychiatrist for 20 years! Adderall has helped me more than all the b.s. spouted at me by psychologists and psychiatrists I have seen. There is a definite profit motive in the medical profession. For instance, I saw a psycho-pharmacologist for seven years and he never diagnosed me with ADHD. Then I told him that a friend thinks I have ADHD and he gives me a twenty-question yes/no test and concludes that I have ADHD. If I had this diagnosis and Adderall years before, he would have lost a lot of money. I now look back on the treatments I have been given with a cynical eye. So, who or what can I trust in American psychiatric medicine?

I am tired of struggling to be healthy and not have my problems overwhelm my life. I am intelligent and capable of getting a degree in math, so say my friends who either have PhDs in math or are close to getting them. It is frustrating to be as intelligent as them but to always fail or screw-up one way or another. Unless I can find a solution to these problems, I will have trouble getting a bachelors degree in math, much less a PhD.


Questions
Do people think the Amen clinic would be worth going to for the assessment? Insurance will cover 60% of the cost and my father said he would pay the 40% remaining. My concern at this point is not money spent; my concern is getting my ADHD and other disorders I suffer from properly treated. If I do have a learning disability, can the Amen brain scans detect this?

Does anyone know of an expert in ADHD in Northern California?

Does anyone have any advice?

I need a solution that works!

Thanks in advance,
JD

[junetown]

painful to read. seriously. i have a friend who's been through so many crap spewing therapists ... ugh. they all tell her something different. it's very important to always remember that any specialist, therapist, or otherwise is just as full of opinion and bias as the rest of us. the person who knows you the best is YOU. unless you're schizophrenic, like my grandpa, who says he helped build the pyramids. (maybe in a past life, but seriously, how can anyone say that's good self observation for the 'now'?)

i can't help you here (never seen a therapist or anyone for mental stuff). only support. i'm sorry, and best of luck to you.

[Dex4Me]

I have heard good things about the Amen clinic. I have never been there though. UC Berkeley is pretty good and progressive about ADDD/ADHD studies, therapy and treatement. So is Stanford U. I can personally recommend a psychiatrist/neurologist that has an office near the Stanford Medical Center. His name is Dr. Christopher Capelle.

Hope you work things out. I went through a lot of Hell before getting a medication that works for me.

[Dizfriz]

jondoeai

On Dr Amen:

The main issue with Amen is that his work has not been replicated. We have his reports and that is it. Now this does not mean that he is not on to something but it does mean that his work has not passed scientific scrutiny. Basically, if you can afford it then I cannot see where it can hurt. You may get great help or you may get nothing for your money. You pays your money and takes your chances with unproven therapies.

Here is a suggestion:
The National Resource Center on AD/HD:
Funded through a cooperative agreement with the Centers for Disease Control, this is extremely useful as a central place to start your education on ADHD. The information given is up to date and very reliable. You can ask questions and someone will get back to you. I tested the email service with a fairly technical diagnosis question and they came back with a good solid accurate answer. It would be a very good place to inquire on Dr Amen.

You can ask questions here:
http://www.help4adhd.org/info_request.cfm



On their site there is a list of Hospital and University AD/HD Centers. There is one listed in California that will accept adults. The problem is that it is San Diego.

The site for the centers:
http://www.help4adhd.org/en/treatment/prof/centers

University of California -- San Diego
UCSD Outpatient Psychiatric Services
Adult Attention Deficit Program
Program Notes: Serves adults.University of California -- San Diego

Do consider that this is your life and you have to live the rest of it. Might be worth considering a few trips. You generally get the best expertise from major universities and teaching hospitals.

Good luck
Dizfriz

[lis dexia]

Originally Posted by jondoeai

Questions
Do people think the Amen clinic would be worth going to for the assessment? Insurance will cover 60% of the cost and my father said he would pay the 40% remaining. My concern at this point is not money spent; my concern is getting my ADHD and other disorders I suffer from properly treated. If I do have a learning disability, can the Amen brain scans detect this?

Good luck. Amen was an option that I researched. You don't have to get scanned to receive a diganosis and treatment. They might try to sway you in that direction, because, well, it's what they do. But they were absolutely willing to see me knowing that I was not going to be able to afford the "dexlue" assessment.

BTW - I didn't go there, but the Wealthcare Industry managed to drag the whole thing out for me where it would have been to my advantage to have gone the Amen route. Your mileage may vary - cause, you are you!

All the best.

[TygerSan]

Do people think the Amen clinic would be worth going to for the assessment? Insurance will cover 60% of the cost and my father said he would pay the 40% remaining. My concern at this point is not money spent; my concern is getting my ADHD and other disorders I suffer from properly treated. If I do have a learning disability, can the Amen brain scans detect this?

I would be very careful with the insurance if you go to the Amen clinic, and make sure you get it in writing that they will reimburse you for the expense (read the fine print in your policy). These things are $$$$$$, and places like Amen don't take insurance up front (which means it's all out of network). . . some policies will deny out-of-network charges if you 1) don't get preauthorization, or 2) provide some sort of rationale for going out of network, when there are in-network MD's who ostensibly provide the same service. Your mileage may vary, of course.

[ToneTone]

If the meds worked before, I am confident they will work again! I say you can be hopeful.

Are you seeing a therapist? Despite all the meds can do, many adhd'ers have social deficits and long-time debilitating habits and we need training and guidance to help us retrain ourselves out of the dysfunctional coping patterns we have learned. It is asking way too much of psychiatry to think it can solve relationship issues, old pain, disappointment, fear of failure, social rejection, etc. There's a good chance you really could benefit from the weekly therapy thing with a really good therapist who has worked with people with the particular deficits you have.

A generic therapist won't work. You need someone deeply familiar with your issues. This is in addition to the meds, of course, not a substitute.

I think your psychiatrist is helping you. You most likely can benefit from an entire battery of tests. I'm not sure the Amen clinic is the place that would handle all of that. I know they do the spect stuff. (Those images are amazing and haunting and sometimes frightening to me!) Do they do learning disabilities assessment and diagnosis as well?

If I could have afforded the Amen Clinic, I would have gone in a heartbeat. Yes, I would have. But if I were you, I would probably investigate some really good learning assessment folks in the Berkeley area and I'd go through their battery of tests and all. I'd start there because I think you'll get a lot more testing and time and hours of thinking by the test administrators for the money (than you would with the Amen Clinic).

It sounds like you have some older issues beyond adhd. I am just not totally confident that the Amen folks will hone in on those earlier issues with the precision that would really benefit you. On the other hand, maybe they would.

Have you read Amen's books? I would read them carefully, especially the one on adhd. That way you could enter that process much more informed and would possibly get more out of them.

Bottom line: if you want, go to the Amen folks. But do NOT take it as the last chance, there-is-no-hope-after this kinda move. It is not the last chance. If they don't end up helping you that much, then move on to another group of folks. They are not the last word. With that qualifier, I say go for it. (But remember, there are dozens of excellent psychologists, therapists, social workers, shrinks, neurologists and adhd specialists right there in your area--dozens who are as good or better than the Amen folks.)

I'd love to hear the results of your visits. I have good vibes about your future.

[ToneTone]

Jon,

I'd love for you to keep us posted on your next move. Good luck.
Tone