Picking Arguments because of ADHD

[KFC in CA]

What's up with that?

This issue is part of another thread, but it's mixed in with other issues. I thought I'd ask as it's own narrowly focused topic so that the discussion could be just on that.

There seems to be a number of reasons given for this. I'll start with my perspective.

ADHD is not a reason for picking arguments. Irritation, anger, frustration, stress, etc are reasons. These are primarily temperament driven, emotionally driven. I have a number of choices to select from when I am compelled to argue. I can choose to walk away, say I can't deal with the topic now, quietly nod and come back to discuss later. I have lots of choices. Impulsively arguing is only one of them. I say this as a person who can be uncontrollably compulsive at times, too. I'm lucky I have a tongue, heh.

So, let the discussion begin if anyone is interested in carrying it forth in this thread.

[cdub998]

I was thinking about this last night. One thought that crashed into me last night was. What if I pick fights from time to time because of the stimulation to my brain. I know some ADD'ers seek stimulation. what if that is another outlet?

[ADHDTigger]

I would completely agree for the most part. I have had times when I was so stuck though that I kept with it. I use any number of things to try to interrupt that but there is a point of no going back and it just needs to run out. I know it's a stimulation issue because I have been able to de-rail it by taking 5 mg of Adderall and hiding in the bathroom until it kicks in.

I can usually avoid the problem entirely by taking L-Tyrosine in the evenings before dinner. It has gotten better.

In general, I have better control, but there have definitely been times that I have lost it completely and generally, it is my brain doing things that I just cannot stop. Half the time, I don't even know that I am doing it. Someone has to tell me later.

[ADHDTigger]

Originally Posted by cdub998

I was thinking about this last night. One thought that crashed into me last night was. What if I pick fights from time to time because of the stimulation to my brain. I know some ADD'ers seek stimulation. what if that is another outlet?

It is widely believed that it is. The trick is to try to catch yourself doing it and finding effective ways to redirect the brain's need for stimulation. Not always easy to do.

[GetSet]

Originally Posted by cdub998

I was thinking about this last night. One thought that crashed into me last night was. What if I pick fights from time to time because of the stimulation to my brain. I know some ADD'ers seek stimulation. what if that is another outlet?

That's exactly how I am. People say I don't know when to stop. I just play devil's advocate to anything anyone says, just for the fun of it, I guess, I'm not really sure why at all...

[KFC in CA]

My question to all:

Is it anger that fuels you... or the "stimulation"?


I can debate, argue, whatever. As long as I'm not angry, I can control what I say and I can disengage. Once I am angry and sucked into an argument, I don't care if it takes a month, I *will have the last word*!! Heh, I say sucked, because I really try to avoid arguing when I'm mad for this reason. Angry, I can't disengage. I also can't sensor what I say, which can get a lot nastier than I'd ever intend.

[ADHDTigger]

Originally Posted by KFC in CA

My question to all:

Is it anger that fuels you... or the "stimulation"?


I can debate, argue, whatever. As long as I'm not angry, I can disengage. Once I am angry and sucked into an argument, I don't care if it takes a month, I *will have the last word*!! Heh, I say sucked, because I really try to avoid arguing when I'm mad for this reason. Angry, I can't disengage. I also can't sensor what I say, which can get a lot nastier than I'd ever intend.

EXACTLY!!! We are twins! You just described me perfectly!

I try really hard to stay out of the anger zone because once I'm there, I can be absolutely deadly. But I tend to think that it isn't anger- or at least it isn't some of the time. The reason I say that is because just a little bit of Adderall and I am not so mad any more.

The kick is that if I truly am angry, there is not a force on the earth that can stop me and woe betide you if I am angry at you. Adderall won't touch it. My partner has learned that making me justifiably mad is a losing game.

[RedHairedWitch]

My Mom is ADHD with a big H and she will hyperfocus on something so much its drives her nuts, she feels she HAS to say something. Over and over and over again, constantly re-starting the same argument.

I am less interested in conflict (more inattentive) and would rather go ride my bike down a steep hill for stimulation, and I don't hyper focus on negative stuff as badly as she does.

[Grafter]

Originally Posted by ADHDTigger

I try really hard to stay out of the anger zone because once I'm there, I can be absolutely deadly.

This has been my experience as well. However, controlling it (most of the time) has been a difficult and slow task. It takes EXTREME DILIGENCE to get to a point where you (an ADD'r) default to a self-monitoring state.

At this point, I know the times (first 30-40 minutes after I get up & sometimes at the end of a hard day) when I am most susceptible to becoming angry. At these times I work on a kind of auto-pilot... trying to maintain a dull personality. My wife is also aware of these times, and (mostly) respects that. She (mostly) respects when I state "Not now" also.

When I first read about the "stimulating" aspects of arguing I identified with it instantly. Most of the time, when I am getting in that argumentative mood, or zone, I can also, literally, feel that stimulation occurring.

That has now become a personal trigger to back up and think about what's happening.

The point is this, that "stimulation seeking" argumentative behavior is NOT something that can't be overcome. If we are "seeking" stimulation, there are much better ways of doing it. But it takes hard work and commitment from both partners to make it through. If my NT partner has decided that she WANTS to get under my skin for something... Again, I have to try to determine intent on her side as well. Is it me, her, what do I need to do here?

On a side note, there are also downsides to over self-monitoring... paralysis by analysis. It usually rears it's presence in a discussion where the NT'r finally blurts out "Why don't you just answer?" or something along those lines. Often, I've run the gamut on a statement, never said a word, and she is off onto something else. 20 minutes later, we're arguing about EVERYTHING and totally forgotten the original issue. Eh, another thread I guess.

[kwalk]

Red haired that's my mom to a T. I'm probably like you haha and when I do get really angry it can be about something stupid and all of a sudden i'm talking a thousand words per a minute. then that minute is over and a new subject starts. But man I can't stand my mom, as well as her argueing with my bipolar/adhd sister whose voice is like scraping nails on a chalk board. Every second she gets she spends picking on someone in the house or her dirty house she never cleaans, and who knows what next subject she'll have.

[somuchbetter]

In one sense however, this can be a good thing. I like to debate , not argue. Before, I would just keep my mouth shut and not give two cents because I'd be afraid my argument wasn't pieced together correctly. But now, I can keep my thoughts collected and put in a point that I would not have before because of my "stuttering" or insecurities. So I seem more argumentative than before, but I would like to say that I speak my mind a little better.

[kettish]

somuchbetter, I'm with you on that. I used to just sort of let people do/say whatever and I'd retreat if I didn't want it. Lol.

I'm actually MORE aggressive now that I'm on adderall. The thing I've learned though is that before, I was having trouble 'activating' enough to do much, and the way I was handling my anger was to stay as firmly planted in that deactivation mode as possible. This wasn't healthy or productive, naturally, but I was so afraid of saying something wrong that I didn't care.

Now I find that when I get angry, I really want to say something about it!!! I'll try and get DH go argue with me (mostly so I can figure out what's wrong and then fix it, as the man is the WORST about letting me know what he needs) but sometimes I find myself taking it a little too far. At that point I go do something else, preferably outside the home, so I can rant and rave in the car to my little recorder and get it out of my system.

I reeeeeaaaaaalllllllyyyyy need things resolved quickly though. By quickly I mean within a few hours if possible, but at the very least before bedtime. I can't sleep if whatever issue it is hasn't been resolved.

[QueensU_girl]

Dr. Daniel Amen says picking fights is a way for some people to get their "stimming".

[oddjobace]

yep, it is a way to get stimming. I think the biggest problems is that, like a mouse in a maze going for cheese and getting better and better at it, We may not even know we are doing it.

[Sieve]

Originally Posted by oddjobace

yep, it is a way to get stimming. I think the biggest problems is that, like a mouse in a maze going for cheese and getting better and better at it, We may not even know we are doing it.

No kidding.

I have just begun a mix of treatment for my ADHD (leaning towards hyperactivity) and my "stimming" from picking fights has gotten to be absolutely out of hand. I will casually pick a fight with my boyfriend so quickly, I don't even realize the words coming out of my mouth until I'm knee deep in a philosophical discussion about minutae regarding our relationship and how eternally dissatisfied/paranoid I am.

Unbelievable. It's unbelievable! I literally watch helplessly as the words drip from my tongue with so much venom I could strip walls. Afterwards, I feel satisfied. Like I am rewarded once the end of the argument is reached because I have exerted my energy, reached the stimulation I needed, and hammered out an issue that was on my mind as well. Of course, it leaves my Aspie boyfriend left feeling cold and as if I am a petulant brat.

I'm aware that it's an uphill battle but one that is fought diligently, but it sure makes the fighting extremely discouraging when you see yourself dismantling your relationships along the way.