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Vyvanse (lisdexamfetamine dimesylate)

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  #1  
Old 05-17-10, 11:03 AM
Carmine Carmine is offline
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Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

Hey all! New to the forums. How is everyone? Been reading that if I take baking soda with water. Wait about half hour and then take my vyvanse. That the vyvanse will be stronger and last longer.

I woke up at 6:30am. Drank water with baking soda. At 7:30am I took my vyvanse. It's 11am now and I don't feel anything at all!

What happened?
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Old 05-22-10, 01:05 AM
JR1973 JR1973 is offline
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Re: Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

Can't say what happened but the baking soda trick doesn't work with Vyvanse. Nothing happens with Vyvanse until it passes from the stomach and into the small intestine. At that point the body has already adjusted pH levels.

The baking soda trick only works with regular Adderall and Dexedrine.
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Old 05-22-10, 08:46 PM
Carmine Carmine is offline
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Re: Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

Ah! I see! So is there anything I can do to help Vyvanse last longer? That is IF I still want to take Vyvanse.
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Old 05-22-10, 09:06 PM
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Re: Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmine View Post
Hey all! New to the forums. How is everyone? Been reading that if I take baking soda with water. Wait about half hour and then take my vyvanse. That the vyvanse will be stronger and last longer.

I woke up at 6:30am. Drank water with baking soda. At 7:30am I took my vyvanse. It's 11am now and I don't feel anything at all!

What happened?
Its too weak.
I suggest to up the Vyvanse, especially if its around 30mg.

I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS TRUE.
It could have killed it though, since Vyvanse has to be metabolized or digested I think...
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Old 05-24-10, 06:54 AM
JR1973 JR1973 is offline
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Re: Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

You can't really make Vyvanse last longer. Amphetamines have a decent half life of 11 hours or so once they are in your body. The baking soda trick with regular amphetamines only increases how well they absorb but it doesn't make them last longer.

There are ways to reduce the rate at which amphetamines are excreted via urine but that involves screwing with urinary pH and thus messes with the Kidneys. Not a good thing to do.
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Old 05-24-10, 07:12 PM
novaprospekt novaprospekt is offline
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Re: Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

As others said you can't use the "baking soda trick" with Vyvanse because it isn't true amphetamine until your stomach and intestine's protease enzymes activate it.

Vyvanse is dextroamphetamine conjugated to the amino acid Lysine (hence the name lisdexamfetamine, Vyvanse's chemical name) and is only active once that lysine residue is removed by the G.I. tract. The baking soda raises the pH of the stomach which actually does more harm than good for Vyvanse... the stomach's protease enzymes (notably pepsin) needs low pH around 1-2 to work properly and by you raising the pH you lower the activity of stomach enzymes and less lisdexamfetamine is converted to d-amphetamine while in your stomach.

Also, as others previously said, the baking soda only enhances absorption of amphetamine (by deprotonating the charged terminal amine making the compound electrically neutral and easier to pass through the membranes of your G.I. tract) it doesn't make the drug more powerful at all.

You cannot prolong Vyvanse unless you inhibit the liver enzyme that metabolizes it (CYP2D6 is the enzyme that metabolizes d-amphetamine, the active compound). I don't really encourage you doing this because it can cause other unforeseeable problems, but most SSRI (antidepressants), the antifungal drug Lamisil and the antihistamine diphenhydramine (Benadryl, Tylenol PM, etc.) are known inhibitors of this enzyme. Again, I don't recommend you purposely take these substances to prolong the drug but it is just for your information.

Hope this helps.
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Old 06-25-10, 03:19 AM
Nick Nick is offline
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Re: Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

It's interesting because I have tested this for the last few days. What I did was take Vyvanse, and then a couple hours later, after I am sure that some sort of digestive action has been taken (even though I can't feel the Vyvanse working), I take a half teaspoon of baking soda in water.

I wish I conducted this test a little more strictly, because I did change my Vyvanse dosages a little bit, and that could be responsible for the increased effect I have gotten.

However, I have noticed that the Vyvanse has in fact become stronger and lasted stronger longer, and this could be caused by the slightly increased Vyvanse dose I took, or it could be the baking soda.

If it is the baking soda, then that is wonderful news and I need to figure out exactly why it is doing what it is doing.

Does anyone have any ideas how this could be?
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Old 06-25-10, 02:37 PM
novaprospekt novaprospekt is offline
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Re: Did baking soda kill my vyvanse?

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Originally Posted by Nick View Post
It's interesting because I have tested this for the last few days. What I did was take Vyvanse, and then a couple hours later, after I am sure that some sort of digestive action has been taken (even though I can't feel the Vyvanse working), I take a half teaspoon of baking soda in water.

I wish I conducted this test a little more strictly, because I did change my Vyvanse dosages a little bit, and that could be responsible for the increased effect I have gotten.

However, I have noticed that the Vyvanse has in fact become stronger and lasted stronger longer, and this could be caused by the slightly increased Vyvanse dose I took, or it could be the baking soda.

If it is the baking soda, then that is wonderful news and I need to figure out exactly why it is doing what it is doing.

Does anyone have any ideas how this could be?
Well, if it is indeed the baking soda causing it, then it has to do with pH.

The other amphetamine drugs like Dexedrine and Adderall are susceptible to the pH of your stomach and urine for how they are metabolized. An acidic stomach (such as after a glass of orange juice...citric acid, or a salad...vinegar-acetic acid) will decrease the absorption of your medication. Also, if your urine is acidic (influenced by the acidity of your GI tract) then less drug is reabsorbed and the net effect is that it's excreted out of the body faster than it should be.

The converse is true for high pH (or alkalinity). Taking the Adderall with a Tums, or baking soda or anything that raises stomach pH will cause above average absorption (sometimes to the point where too much is absorbed) and will increase urinary pH. Alkaline urine will cause more of the drug to be retained longer than it should and not get excreted out of the body.

If you're interested in the science behind this, it has to do with the charge of the amphetamine molecule.

When in the presence of low pH (high concentration of free protons), the terminal amino group becomes charged (from NH2 to NH3+). Charged molecules aren't absorbed as well as neutral molecules through the linings of the GI tract. Same is true for the urine. If too much free amphetamine is charged, then it can't pass out of the to-be urine in the kidneys back into blood.

In a high pH situation (low conc. of free protons), the amino group is uncharged (the 3rd proton is ripped off making it neutral NH2) and that allows it to be better absorbed than the charged species.

Now, I oversimplified this -- in reality, there's a balance of charged and uncharged medicine at all times. Your intestines are alkaline, around pH 8-9 I believe, whereas your stomach is as you know very acidic, pH1-2 (or possibly less). It's all about the proportion of charged to uncharged that determines the overall effect of too much reabsorption or too little.

Vyvanse shouldn't be affected by the stomach contents because it isn't true amphetamine until it is processed by proteases in the stomach and liver. It takes a special route of absorption (the amino acid pathway) because it's connected to lysine. Once the lysine is gone, then theoretically it should behave as Dexedrine and is likely to be susceptible to urinary pH (but NOT gastrointestinal pH).
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I am not a doctor. I am a 21yo college student studying biochemistry and pre-medicine. I have extensive interest in pharmacology, particularly in the fields of mental disorders. I hope my advice is helpful but always discuss problems or changes to medications with your doctor first!
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